"Why does someone working inside their garage think that they can make a car look better then a designer that is professionally trained & experienced in that field?" - Jay Leno
Bravo, Jay Leno. The quickest way to turn art into garbage is to street rod or customize a car. The only time it should be considered is if a car is on the way to the crusher. Street rods are the automotive equivalent to an aborted fetus.
If not the most beautiful car every made, the 1954 to 1956 Cadillac's are certainly in the top 5. Here's what it should look like (i.e. not "customized").
What the fuck is that?? A wardrobe on wheels?
American cars were shit, are shit and will always be shit.
Are you a woman or just a man who cant turn a wrench?
true fact- large wheels and $200 worth of bolt ons from Pep boys DOES not mean your ride is custom.. Clearly your wifes car is nicer then yours she prob. built it herself..."Built Not Bought"
^spoken like someone with no imagination. It's part of our human condition to have a sense of individuality. I question peoples choice of car accessories often. Does your ricer need a huge-ass spoiler, a fake hood scoop and LED windshield washer fluid nozzles? No. Doe your 4x4 need to be jacked-up so high I could drive my car under it? No. But that's all part of living in the free world Jay Leno. Doing what the f**k we want. If I wanted to look and think like everyone else I'd move to a communist country.
THE POINT IS, that everyday there are fewer and fewer vintage cars with accidents, fires, rust, and other calamities. We don't need even fewer because of nitwits that think they can do a better job then Virgil Exner or Harley Earl then wind up ruining the damn car!
Be an individual...hang dingle balls from your damn roof if your dead set on looking like an idiot. JUST DON'T CUT, SAW & FUCK UP PERFECTLY GOOD VINTAGE CARS!!!
V12 Toyota Supra with 1000bhp. Lapped the Nardo at 222mph and can get around corners AND has brakes!! Unlike american trash.
^LOL, spoken like someone who can only afford a Toyota Supra, ROFLMFAO!!!^
Gee, I wonder why people pay hundreds of thousands & even MILLIONS for classic American cars if they're "trash"? And there are SO MANY jap rice burners that are considered "classic cars" aren't there? (Try ZERO)
Thanks for proving to all of us that you have no class whatsoever! LOL
Only a wanker would think some modern rice burner is nicer than a 54 caddy. His mom probably fucked an Irishman.
^LOL, & I couldn't agree with you more....well said, sir!^
HEY! I'm Irish and I do not like rice burners. My first car was a 63 Falcon with an in line 6. It was a POS when I bought it and got stolen after I spent 2 years restoring her. If I ever find the asshole he's a dead man or woman which ever the case may be, but irrelevant.
A '53 Buick Roadmaster that shows OP's point of some guy having a "vision" then fucking up a car beyond all possible restoration. I would agree that most of these "visions" wind up looking like abortions.
BTW, 90% of the time these idiots ruin the value of their own car and get a fraction for it when they sell it compared to the nicely & properly restored '53 Buick to the left.
I agree 100%. Although I am an Auto Tech by trade, I still wouldn't even try to restore a classic car like that without the help of some other pros. I may be a tech, but that doesn't mean that I can do my own chrome, or a really nice pain job that doesn't look like I was standing in my garage with a can of spray paint. The engine, trans and what not. That is all me, and it would look like brand new.
^Very well put, and what struck me most about your post is your modesty.^ You are an expert IN YOUR FIELD. This is one thing these cut & paste hot rodders & tuners are not, is modest, nor most of them experts.
That's why we have all of these piece-of-shit pink & candy apple red street rod monstrosities running around ruined, never being able to be restored properly thanks to these imbeciles.
If these street rod fuckwits only knew that the 2 or 3 complements they get at car show to stroke their ego are balanced against 200 or 300 hundred that think, "look at that piece of shit, what the hell was he thinking?!" maybe we'd have fewer vintage cars ruined and devalued.
Think about that the next time your driving your purple & pink "LOOK AT ME, LOOK AT ME" abomination down the road!
Here's 2 more examples of a fucked up street rod.....
....and the stock, restored car. What kind of a moron would do that to a 75 year old Cord Beverly??
Why do upper class Americans drive Lexus, BMW, Mercedes and Infiniti?
If American cars were any good... Wouldn't the upper class drive them?
Absolutely, that's why they drive Cadillac CTS-V's, Cadillac Escalades, Lincoln Navigators, Corvette's, Cadillac XLR-V's & etc. If YOU were upper class you'd know this, & also that no one that is TRUE upper class would touch a Lexus or Infiniti. They are "wannabe" cars.
I don't live in America. I am from a country with culture and class.
^You don't live in America...you're just jealous of it^
Forbes 'Worst cars on the road 2011'.
By all accounts, Detroit's Big Three automakers have begun producing better-made, longer lasting, more efficient vehicles. It's a distinct change from the 1990s and early 2000s, when they fell behind their European and Asian counterparts in each category.
"This change is not even a gradual thing," says Christine Overstreet, an automotive consultant and director of Heels and Wheels. "It's like they've said, 'OK, we really want to step it up, we really want to compete, we're ready.' After past years of being so bad, they've really stepped up their game."
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But with three exceptions--the Mercedes-Benz S550, Smart Fortwo and Nissan Titan--all of the cars on this year's list of the Worst Cars on the Road are (still) made by domestic companies. That includes the Dodge Dakota, Chevy Tahoe Hybrid and Chrysler Town & Country. The only American car company with zero vehicles on the list? Ford.
If you thought the best cars you see hardly have any flaws then here is the moment when your beautifully carved fluffed up thoughts are going to get deflated. Forbes is famous for all the lists it comes out with and this time the list has been titled, Forbes 2011 Worst Cars on the Road. Americans love to lead and even this list with an exception of 2011 Mercedes-Benz S-Class, the 2011 Smart ForTwo and the 2011 Nissan Titan, all the coupes have been crafted by American manufacturers.
Well, the sob story doesn’t end here. Two manufacturers who steal the show in this category are General Motors and Chrysler. Normally it is an honor to appear on the Forbes list but this time Ford will feel overwhelmed to not get a spot.
Forbes compiled the list after considering a lot of factors which consisted going through six studies by Consumer Reports. The reports include the Most Reliable Cars Report, Best and Worst Safety Performance Survey, Best and Worst Fuel Economy, Highest Cost of Ownership, the Best and Worst Values Report.
2011 Cadillac Escalade’s base model won the medal for the Worst Value, Highest Cost of Ownership and Worst Safety Performance lists while 2011 Chevrolet Tahoe Hybridlike Cadillac got on the Worst Value and safety list, and another blemish with the Least Reliable roster. The worst General Motors offerings for 2011 were earned by Chevrolet Aveo and Chevrolet Colorado.
2011 Chrysler Town & Country made Chrysler bow down its head in shame as it got a spot for reliability and cost of ownership. 2011 Jeep Wrangler and the Jeep Liberty managed to squeeze in the list as well with the Liberty falling short on reliability and fuel economy. 2011 Jeep Wrangler just like Liberty finds a spot in the reliability section plus also and added worst value spot. The 2011 Dodge Nitro and Dodge Dakota also earn a spot each in similar sections.
A lot of the chopped up or highly custom cars, didn't start out as something worth restoring, they were basket cases that would have been crushed. I restore cars for a living, but we don't start with something totally missing 50% of the parts or that is so rusted out, we will lose money putting it back to better then new. If someone wants to cut up something I wouldn't restore, more power to them, I'll buy the chrome they won't use, and move my project that much closer to the auction.
While I appreciate your post, it's mostly untrue. As a car collector with 7 vehicles currently, I've seen morons over and over again take a perfectly good vintage car and cut, chop, slam, and rod the shit out of them. Why? Because it was "easier" then starting with a basket case.
If what you were saying was true and the car was on its way to the crusher anyway, then there wouldn't be any problem. But I've seen & heard of perfectly good rust free Mercs, Cadillacs, Franklins, Packards and other rare cars that were "customized" & ruined forever. And if it is a rarity, then it is cost efficient to restore no matter how many parts are missing & have to be fabricated.
Not true at all unless your not willing to make a profit. If it's a rarity, as you say, it's even more costly to get involved with a car, that is missing things. Some people have money to throw away, and lose on a investment, but most restorers don't. and except for a 49-50 Merc, no one pays you for all the work that goes into putting a car back right. As someone that really does restore cars, it breaks my heart when I see cars that I can't even begin to get involved with, because there isn't any money in it, because people would rather pay me to build yet another 55-57 Chevy, over the Buick, Pontiac, or Olds, of the same year. I can twice the money out of a Chevelle than I can get out of doing a Olds Cutlass, one because the parts are available, and two the market doesn't pay for certain off brands of cars. So paying to have something fabricated as you state is only possible if it's something someone really wants.
So if your really a collector, then make it worth while for restorers to build a off brand by paying us for our work, no matter what the brand, but in
reality, as builders we are in i to make the most money we can, not to give the collector our hard work for free, when we get to auction, or an advertised sale. So restoring buisnesses like myself don't even touch some of the brands you listed, because the profit isn't there. When those that just buy, and don't do there own work, are willing to pay for the finished product, beyond what we as restorers know to be high profit cars, based on sales. We'd be willing to save more cars.
I'm surprised you re-posted the same failed argument you used before. A few years ago, a gentlemen discovered a long lost 1930's Mercedes-Benz 540K barn find. It was purchased for hundreds of thousands and needed many hand fabricated parts to restore at hundreds of thousands more. The value? $1.5 MILLON to $2.5 MILLION dollars!!! I personally know of Packards, Cadilllacs & even Mercs that have been restored in such a way. So your argument falls flat on its face.
Anyway, no one here started talking about "worth" & "cost" until you did. As with most of the population, you're only seeing the subject from your tiny, myopic point of view. As a collector of 7 vintage vehicles, I can tell you that just as many, if not more of us, restore based upon emotion, desire, & pleasure then with the concern of cost effeciency that seems to drive everything that you do.
Actually people with your penny-pinching view are why dumpy street rods exist at all. Back in the 40's and 50's people would buy junkers and street rod them because they didn't have the money &/or the talent to restore vehicles properly. Unfortunately they persuaded a percentage of the population along the way that these eyesores were "cool". These are the major reason that many cars are still "customized" today. It's just too bad, as many others here have said, that these idiots are taking perfectly good vintage cars and ruining them, rather then getting them from the junk yard as in the old days like they should.
With all of the horrible customized cars I've seen and the 3 examples pictured on this thread, it amazes me that the guy above you is still trying to defend street rodding! In a case like this, he demonstrates what happens when you sell out for money and greed is the only motivator. Very sad.
There are more people buying and restoring cars as a business then there are people that buy and throw away money on something that they will get no return. if you feel you can buy and afford to lose on every investment you make, then maybe your able too, But as a buisness owner that is responsible for putting a check in my employees hands, I still say i move on average 15-20 cars a year. I don't own them in a collection, I buy restore to better then original then put them on the market for the consumer. At the same time I'm employing more then 15 people. I need to make a profit. certain cars make more profit for me than other, and I can sell a clone of a 70's chevelle for more than a base olds cutlass, so you know what, I buy every malibu with the 396( really a 402) I can get my hands on, and then buy reproduction parts, dash, badges, ect. and the market the consumer, buys them up every time making sure I can employ my workers. You own 7 car supposedly that you hold on too, and don't care if you make a dime off of, in fact your stating when the time comes, it will be all right with you if you lose money, well that's fine for you, but in 5 years, my buisness will save more than 100 cars from deteriorating farther, and put them back out in to the world better then when they were new, and you will still have the same 7 cars. In 10 years that's another 200 cars that my buisness will restore and put out there for consumption, and I will help to house, feed, and give medical care to my employees. You will maybe sell a car for a loss and buy another persons work for as little as you can. The one car you stated is less .001% of the restoration buisness that goes on in a year, as I'm not the only one doing this. You are no diferent then the racist that hates a person based on color, you hate because someone is doing somethin you wouldn't then making the stupidist argument with a rare care owned by a single person restoring for there pleasure.
I'm not defending street rodding a car, I restore to better than original in fit and finish, with a product that looks as close to or better then original. i do not build custums, I don't like them myself, but unless your willing to start restoring a hell of a lot more, and collecting a little less, it's going to happen. My buisness will continue to put vehicles in the hands of people that perfer to buy then build. Haqte me and all the rest of the world all you want, but your not really doing anything when you just buy and hold onto cars for years and years, if you really want to save cars. You need to start selling your "collection" and buying and restoring wrecks, rather than letting these people you hate buy them, and you can be part of the solution rather then part of the problem.
I never said that I buy and then lose on investments....you're like a damn dog that you need to keep hitting in the head with a stick, but he just never learns. What I said, was that many, many vintage car decisions are based on something other then money. Just because you are constantly worried about and looking at turning a buck, doesn't mean we all are. Secondly, even in this economy, I'm still money ahead, based on current sales levels, with all 7 of my collector vehicles. But again not everyone, & as a matter of fact many, are not looking at their collector cars as "investments". There. Now do you finally get it??
Again, you need to pull your head out of your tunnelvision and realize that just because you have certain motives (aka the almighty dollar), it doesn't mean everyone else does things for the same reasons you do. You make a lot of presumptions with "maybe" this and "maybe" that w/o knowing anything about me, 90% of it being factually incorrect. In any event I've tried to re-explain it 3 different ways to you in just this post. Hopefully you finally get it.
I think what the restorer guys is saying is that just because you have seven cars on your front lawn doesn't mean your a collector, it means your a hoarder. You read into his statements also. He needs to turn a profit, so some cars he doesn't buy, what's not to get. Your the one that said you'd lose on a car just because you'd like to see it restored, and got nasty with him first when he made a point, then you changed your tune. Maybe you should read your own posts.
Also I think everyone I meet at car shows thinks there car is worth more then what they have into it, most think they will make out better when it comes time to sell. Sp that means there looking at it as some kind of investment. Maybe the kind of guy that beats a dog is just to stupid to buy and sell cars like this other guy.
It seems to me that you ARE the restorer guy answering in the 3rd person. In any event, your attempt to try to diminish me by calling me a "hoarder" is very childish. I don't have a "front yard", and my collection is housed in a temperature controlled building.
What you don't seem to get is this isn't a thread about turning a profit...it's a thread about ruining cars by incorrect restoration & street rodding. Now, do YOU get it (for the tenth time!)?
You are obviously totally ignorant of the collector car realm, as I don't have to "think" or guess what my vehicles are worth. They are insured via "agreed value" insurance which confirms what my collection is worth. So wise up, and learn what the hell you're talking about before you post.
You mean like Chris Foose. Hate the work that he does, ruins every car he touches.
GM, Chrysler dominate 'worst cars' list. Oh, and the UAW wants to thank you for bailing them out.
Read more at the Washington Examiner: http://washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/2011/04/gm-chrysler-dominate-worst-cars-list-oh-and-uaw-wants-thank-you-b#ixzz1eGCdkBcE
Thank goodness we put up $80 billion to bail out GM and Chrysler. They are now building such wonderful cars that they have achieved total dominance of the Forbes "Worst Cars on the Road" list, which we could also call the "Bottom Eleven."
GM and Chrysler account for nine of the cars among the bottom eleven. IN other news, the UAW is grateful for your generosity in keeping their union from disappearing. It appears you've achieved little else with your donation.
It is worth noting that all cars on this list except the Mercedes Benz S550 failed safety and/or reliability tests, in addition to being failures in such areas as value and gas mileage.
Cadillac Escalade
Chevrolet Tahoe Hybrid
Dodge Nitro
Jeep Wrangler
Dodge Dakota
Mercedes Benz S550
Chrysler Town and Country
Chevrolet Colorado
Chevrolet Aveo
Jeep Liberty
OP here. Gentlemen (& ladies), while I agree that GM and Ford are building better cars then they were 20 years ago, and while I also agree that the bailouts of the auto companies & their unions were a disaster and total waste of taxpayer $$$, this is not the thread for that.
This thread is discuss the ruining antique and vintage cars by street rodding and customizing. Early on we had a poster try to compare Jap rice-burner throw-away cars to classic American cars. While ridiculous on its face, it too was also inappropriate to this thread, and he was dealt with quickly buy a poster asking him to name one asian classic car. Obviously there was no answer, much less one that someone would be willing to pay $250,000 for as they would with a Cadillac, Packard, or European makes like Mercedes-Benz, or Bugatti, or Aston-Martin.
While debating the current status of GM, Ford or even Mopar and their value compared with European or even Asian brands is a worthy discussion, I would ask that you please start a new thread to carry on that conversation as it is not germaine to our purposes here. Thank you.
Just curious do you feel it's ok to cut a car up that wouldn't be worth $250,000, even if it's pristine? Or is it not ok to cut up any car?
Most of us that see the number of original vintage cars dwindling feel that the only cars that should be cut, chopped, slammed, leaded, frenched, or rodded are the cars in the junk yard &/or on their way to the crusher.
There are PLENTY of those available rather then taking the lazy way and ruining a perfectly good vintage car whether it's worth $25K or $250K.
You do know Jay Leno took a perfectly good 1966 Oldsmobile Tornado and tore it apart and put it on a Corvette frame with a chevy engine.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G05J7x6LARM
LOL, yeah I know that...when I saw it on T.V. it did rub me the wrong way. But from what I understand the rest of the car is totally stock, and it wouldn't take much to put in the correct engine and drivetrain again if one wanted to. That is a far cry from cutting the shit out of a vintage car, slathering it with plastic, painting it "plum crazy", dumping the typical Chevy 350 in it irregardless of the make, and ruining beyond all repair.
Actually he totally pulled the body off of the frame, used 2 totaled Corvettes for the new frame making it rear wheel drive and, cut up and modified the front structure of the car to accommodate the twin turbo motor that he got from Chevy. There is no bringing that car back to what it was easily. He also modified his original 1955 Buick, with a crate motor 572.
http://www.seriouswheels.com/cars/top-1955-Buick-Roadmaster-Jay-Leno.htm
He even talks about in this articale how he took the easy road out rather then building the original motor and dynflow, because sooner or later something would fail. Although because he has money he did reproduce wider wheels and hubcabs for the car to keep a stock look.
Fun though that with his money he took the "easy road" and modified a car that he had all the part's for. Shame when you have all the money and the time to do it right, and still choose to do whatever you want to a car.
Really no different then someone buying any car, that becomes there property, and doing whatever they want.
Now that you bring it up, I remember the '55 Buick too. That one is really suprising because if memory serves it was his first car when he got out to L.A. I guess he must feel if it "looks stock" then that's ok. I personally disagree with that view....
if you want to do it, fine. Just pull a car out of the scrap yard (of which there are many!) to do it rather then ruining an original vintage car.
Another thing that to me is just totally ridiculous is when kids are having burn-out contests, & then some 40, 50, or 60 year old guy will run a collector car through & light the tires up, risking that old car like he's a 16 year old. Seriously, burn-outs ceased to interest me after I turned 19, and here these old farts are still trying to impress people that way.
The first thing that comes to mind when I see an old dude trying to impress like this is, "geez that old fart must have a really small dick or something....."
I don't do cars but i'm rebuilding my superbike myself since my accident has pretty much destroyed it. Adding broader pipes for better exhaustion and a few extra horsepower ... Adding a power commander for performance at different altitudes and different fuel. Changing the gay-ass original graphics scheme to something more my style and chopping off every unnecessary gram of weight. But yeah i suppose you're right i shouldn't meddle with a professional design. Whatever man.
I know it's hard for you to comprehend, but we're talking about CARS here. But ok, I'll bite.
Actually please DO modify the shit out of your bike and take off every excess pound of weight....then your next accident will destroy you as well as your bike, since you were too stupid to learn your lesson last time. Don't worry, I'll laugh out loud when they show your skull getting crushed on "Worlds Dumbest Videos". One less tuner in the world, YEA!
Yeah i'm a fucking tuner waste man. While you're blundering along in your 'classic' which does what? 50 miles an hour tops burning gas like it's free, i'm gonna be cruising at 200 kmph at 15 km on a litre, cruising btw cause my top speed is just under 300. I do agree that hot rods are for faggots though just like hummer2s but not everyone who works outta thier garage is a tasteless twat ... Also i'd never buy vintage bikes, too heavy, too slow and too expensive to replace parts.
^Another idiot that has no idea wtf he's talking about. Allow me to educate you; cars of the 1950's have such tremendous horse power because in many areas of the U.S. at that time there were NO speed limits. When you left a town & entered rural areas a sign might say "resume safe speed". It was not uncommon at all to be met by a Cadillac, Mercury, Buick or Packard doing 100 m.p.h. or better.
BTW, just because you like to risk your life & crash your bikes doesn't mean that everyone that doesn't agree with you is a twat...sounds more like you need to grow up a little bit.
I need to grow up? Wow, that stings. So your gas guzzeling blocks of american iron could hit 100? Haha i'd love to see one of those pieces of shit hit a 45 degree without canber or a shikain and quickly become the scrap heap they're destined to be ;)
Not to mention that your 100 max is still 30 short of my cruising speed.
He said, "100 m.p.h., and OVER", you imbecile! And those are 60 year old cars that are stock, not some stripped out piece-of-shit bike you ruined!
If your "cruising speed" is 130, no wonder you're wrecking your motorcycle, you retarded shithead! LOL
For the record even a Hyundai Getz does over a hundred miles an hour, American cars are a fucking joke all over the world. Mad respect to the biker for surviving! So many of us don't.
You fucking idiot, as was posted TWICE before, the cars he's talking about going over 100 were designed 50 and 60 years ago! On top of that many of them weigh 2 tons or more! I swear, the more "intellegent" people get, with more college degrees then ever, posts like yours show how ignorant and stupid people these days really are!
The only difference between a '55 Cadillac & a "Hyundai Getz" is that it takes a Hyundai a half our to get to 100! It's a piece of shit car, and you're a moron.
I'll bet this guy would by a classic Vincent Black Shadow, or Indian Chief and take the "gay ass graphics" off them too. What an idiot.
Read above for my response ... Old bikes are for old bikers. 'There are old riders and bold riders but there are no old, bold riders.' and i'm happy with that.
IF YOU CAME TO ME 6 MONTHS AGO ID TOTALLY GIVE YOU 5 MIL FOR UR 66 SHELBY
BUT THE MARKET ISNT AS STRONG RIGHT NOW
$5 Mill for a '66 Shelby? LMFAO!! Anyone that makes a stupid deal like that would be out of business in a week! Whether its now or 6 months ago. A Mercedes 540K maybe, but a '66 Shelby?.....ROFLMFAO!!!
Are you fucking kidding me? So you pick out Carroll Shelby's PERSONAL car as a real world example?? LOL And your contending that he would take it to those low class nitwits at "Pawn Stars" to sell it? The only thing not ridiculous about your post is that its not worth $5 million now...that part is accruate.
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2011/12/05/fleet-ferraris-ruined-in-sports-car-freeway-pileup-in-japan/
It always cracks me up how these idiot Ferrari owners go out & try to show off, then wind up wrecking their cars. It says a lot about the type of moron's that buy Ferrari's thinking that means they can drive when they totally lack ability.
Don't believe me? Go to YouTube where there's tons of vids showing Ferrari crashes...not Mercedes-Benz, not Bugatti, not Lamborghini, but Ferrari. Is it small penis syndrome that causes this overriding need to try to get attention?
To be fair american cars suck. aston martin RS/DB 9 The best car ever conseved. PERIOD.
To be fair, you're a biased idiot who has about as much idea what he's talking about as you do in how to spell (conseved? REALLY?). American cars fetch some of the highest prices in the world. Unlike you, I can offer proof:
1948 Tucker Torpedo $2.65 MILLION (Barrett-Jackson auction)
1966 Shelby Cobra 427 Super Snake $5.5 MILLION (Barrett-Jackson auction)
1954 Oldsmobile F-88 $3.24 MILLION (Barrett-Jackson auction)
1931 Duesenberg Murphy-Body Model J $10.34 MILLION (Gooding & Co. auction)
These are just a few examples...so you might want to learn what the hell you're talking about before you post ridiculous rubbish that makes you look like a total fool.
That is all.
Jay Leno should talk! He took a 1966 Olds Toronado and turned it into a Rear drive monster.
You don't get it...he did it in such a way that the car could easily be restored back to stock.
Let's face it, street rodders would be looked upon much more favorably if they took cars out of the junk yard to rod, rather then buying perfectly good cars and customizing (ruining) them past the point that they can ever be restored back to original.
Street rodding and customizing began because kids couldn't afford to fix cars correctly. Today, its still often done because an owner is too cheap to properly restore a vehicle.
